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+--- Thread: To Err - Stepping over the Line (/thread-3530.html)
- Saerin - 2008.Aug.15 11:17 AM
Wook made a decsion and took action based on what he thought was best for him.
Zen made a decision and took action based on what she thought was best best for the game.
Zen has always been a pretty fair admin and even though many of her decisions/coding has not been the most popular among the community, she has always done what she thought was in the best interest of the game and as long as she continues to do that we have little reason to complain.
I seriously doubt that those that she helped out are complaining. I also doubt that if one of us were newbies and had this happen to us that we would complain either.
- DebbiePinson - 2008.Aug.15 11:28 AM
biffbaffboff Wrote:DebbiePinson Wrote:"but for the right reasons"
what are the right reasons? People get hosp'd all the time for inane reasons and no one ever seems to care.
Your really buying into this argument?Just sit in X pats and keep stum you know nothing.Grab yourself a braincell please before you post again.
Seriously, dude. Make sense first and then I might be offended.
I asked an honest question. Where is the line drawn? People get hosp'd all the time for reasons that they are unaware of but no one comes running to their aid. People were hosp'd all day yesterday that were not directly related to what was going on...you have to take your licks and keep training so you get them back yourself. Thats what Ive always been told.
- TommiTheTaco - 2008.Aug.15 11:30 AM
They were? I always thought that there was a game going on around us, and not just our hosp-fest.
- ArtVandelay - 2008.Aug.15 11:40 AM
Do I think an Admin should use their omniscient powers to change the game to help certain players? No, but they run the game so they can do what they want.
Do I think the code should allow me or any player to lose to someone 30 stat levels below us? No, but thats how the game works now.
Game mechanics are game mechanics. If you find a way to take advantage of the game within the rules you might as well take it. It sucks losing to someone below you but thats how the Admin want it.
Act accordingly...
- biffbaffboff - 2008.Aug.15 11:41 AM
Dude the Diss/Xpats war was a hosp fest for sure.In the eyes of every player on both sides any player deemed an enemy was attacked.It had deeper overtones for sure but it looks like these were resolved.That was why the war took place.
As for other players being hospd i am talking about the level 12 duechbag who deserved it for either a scam,online attack,foul mouth or paid hit.These level 12 players know what they have done or have a damn good idea who ordered a hit.These guys have a voice,friends who will assist them and know something of the way the game is run and played.They have integrated and become a part of AL.
The new player who were targeted were pure pawns in a power struggle between the offender and the admins.They had no reason to be hit and had not integrated to AL.Of these new players hit they probably did not even log back in afterwards so the stimmage would have been useless anyways.The point is they did not have a chance to examine the game in detail before there AL experience was cut short.As a business and lets face it this is what it is to Zen and Err, it is suicide to allow the actions of a player to dip their pockets.
It is totally understandable the creators would be pissed.To get anyone to take a look at a TBG is tough enough.The advertising costs that go into getting people to take a look at this game is wasted if every new player is obliterated as soon as they take a peek.I am guessing you want to play AL for a while...if so you need new players with new crisp $$$ to keep the game running or otherwise all your own hard earned that you plowed into AL will be wasted when you try to log in and find out that AL as a business has "gone under".
Makes a nice thought dont it.Now perhaps you will understand the difference between game hosp's and new player hosp's.
- biffbaffboff - 2008.Aug.15 11:57 AM
I would like to add this.I own my own business and have 3 people who work for me.If i found out that one of them was sending business elsewhere how long do you think i would employ them?
Its the same here.I assume Zen spends most of the AL funds she gets in upgrading the game and advertising.She runs it as a business.Sure she like's most of us but if the money dries up what then?If all the advertising and effort that went into getting new membership here was thrown away because of the actions of one of the current members how long before you get rid off the bad apple?
I tell ya zen must have been fuming mad and not for the first time.I think she showed great restraint and used some common sense in stimming those guys out.If someone had threatened to destabalise my business in that way I would not have been so favorable.
- DebbiePinson - 2008.Aug.15 11:59 AM
Understood, but as a donator to this game and also the victim of unjust multiple hospitalizations, Ive taken my licks and pressed on even before I started donating. Which brings me to my point...where is the line? Why is it fair to stim non-donator newbs out but make people who actually donate and contribute to the future of the game, play the game as it was intended to be played? Because we are already sucked in? I don't think its right. I agree with the original poster and not just because he's in my gang.
- biffbaffboff - 2008.Aug.15 12:02 PM
DebbiePinson Wrote:Understood, but as a donator to this game and also the victim of unjust multiple hospitalizations, Ive taken my licks and pressed on even before I started donating. Which brings me to my point...where is the line? Why is it fair to stim non-donator newbs out but make people who actually donate and contribute to the future of the game, play the game as it was intended to be played? Because we are already sucked in? I don't think its right. I agree with the original poster and not just because he's in my gang.
You took your licks but i would bet you anything you want if you looked for another game , made a charactor, logged in and before you even looked at the pantheon you were in hospital for 3 hours you would think screw this for a game and look elsewhere.
I now await the response that actually No i would have come back 3 hours later and made it my ambition to beat that players lights out.Drek talk before you even say it!
- teamhood - 2008.Aug.15 12:05 PM
Ok,
So where is the line drawn? I can only hospitalize someone if:
1. They hosp one of my gang members
2. They hosp me
3. They offend me or make a personal attack..
You see where I am getting at? You have nothing to stand on when it comes to allowable hospitalizations. That is the whole point here people - Why should the game creators decide that a hospitalization is warranted or unwarranted?
Biff,
For the record - I DO NOT WANT CODE CHANGE. The only reason I brought that up is because no rule was broken, therefore Admin should not have involved herself into the drama.
Where is the line? That is question.... and the answer is, there is no line because we all have the ability to hospitalize whoever we please.
What about H4H? Was it ok that I paid them to hit people I had nothing against? That's ok? Again, where is this line from what is acceptable or not?
- mrbadmood - 2008.Aug.15 12:06 PM
This has been a most serious and interesting debate. As I understand it, the question at bottom seems to be where to draw the line with the spirit of the game.
There are valid points on both sides. On the one hand, some of our leading players argue for limited administrative authority over personal affairs, so long as game rules are not violated. On the other, there is an issue of higher level players attacking new players in order to coerce the admins into altering the game code and/or rules.
I suspect a new rule will be the result of all this; perhaps it will mandate the formation of an independent, anonymous group of AL 'justices' to render decisions in sticky cases like this. In either case, I don't think anyone is going to be altogether happy with the outcome.